CAP Discussion

SupahGassy wrote:

I would suggest lowering its stats first of all, stats like that with a Flying/Fight type is ridiculous. and yes more supporting moves you can't just have 18 attacking moves with bulk up and roost

I disagree that its stats are ridiculous. Stat-wise, it is pretty much outclassed by Occrusher currently. Occrusher has higher attack, around the same speed, and around the same defenses. Occrusher also has a better ability than Valair right now, in my opinion.

steel dragons wrote:

SupahGassy wrote:

I would suggest lowering its stats first of all, stats like that with a Flying/Fight type is ridiculous. and yes more supporting moves you can't just have 18 attacking moves with bulk up and roost

I disagree that its stats are ridiculous. Stat-wise, it is pretty much outclassed by Occrusher currently. Occrusher has higher attack, around the same speed, and around the same defenses. Occrusher also has a better ability than Valair right now, in my opinion.

Occrusher defense consists of 95HP/50Def/80SpD while Valair's defenses consist of 100HP/80Def/75SpD and with Roost it has a good way of recovery and with sub it'd be easy to run a subroost set. Also with Technician and having bullet punch/quick attack its speed almost doesn't matter. But yet it sports 100 base speed which can allow it to wreak havoc with a technician boosted STAB Aerial Ace which is only sported on one other pokemon, Scyther, who's typing is much less than perfect compared to Valair's. Also having Bulk Up and Roost allows it to take advantage of it's large HP stat and actually gain bulkiness while being able to retain it through using Roost. If that wasn't bad enough, Valair's offenses are 95/90 in comparison to Occrusher having 135/47... and with the ability of Valair to learn Flamethrower it can basically run perfect covering using Aerial Ace, Flamethrower, and one of it's fighting moves coupled with Roost. It just seems sorta ridiculous that it gets the best of both worlds in being bulky and having the abilities of a mixed sweeper....

Added Sleep Talk to the default list, anyone who included Sleep Talk in their move list may add an extra move if they'd like.

Ok Supergassy, one point at a time...

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Occrusher defense consists of 95HP/50Def/80SpD while Valair's defenses consist of 100HP/80Def/75SpD and with Roost it has a good way of recovery and with sub it'd be easy to run a subroost set.

That is true; also Vallair takes neutral damage from Stealth Rock and no damage from Spikes, whereas Occrusher isn't as lucky.

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Also with Technician and having bullet punch/quick attack its speed almost doesn't matter.

Those priority moves aren't really all that great on Vallair. Its other moves, like Close Combat, Aerial Ace, and Flamethrower, and Roost are al better moves for it. Plus, those priority moves aren't even stabbed, nor do they get good coverage.

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But yet it sports 100 base speed which can allow it to wreak havoc with a technician boosted STAB Aerial Ace which is only sported on one other pokemon, Scyther, who's typing is much less than perfect compared to Valair's.

Scyther does have better attack and speed than Vallair though. A 90 base powered attack isn't the end of the world though; I would worry more about its Close Combat. Vallair does have a better defensive typing, as well as better defenses than Scyther though

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Also having Bulk Up and Roost allows it to take advantage of it's large HP stat and actually gain bulkiness while being able to retain it through using Roost.

That is true, yes. It does have decent defenses, but they aren't unbreakable like Mevenetalno's defenses.

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If that wasn't bad enough, Valair's offenses are 95/90 in comparison to Occrusher having 135/47... and with the ability of Valair to learn Flamethrower it can basically run perfect covering using Aerial Ace, Flamethrower, and one of it's fighting moves coupled with Roost. It just seems sorta ridiculous that it gets the best of both worlds in being bulky and having the abilities of a mixed sweeper....

Vallair's mixed offenses can help it in certain situations, but they aren't really that high. I would worry more about Occrusher's unboosted attacks hitting my Pokémon over Vallair's attacks hitting my Pokémon. Vallair does have decent stats though (not great, but not bad either), and it can do a Bulk Up set pretty well it would seem.
Also, Vallair doesn't have that many special moves. It really would use only Flamethrower or a Hidden Power, which wouldn't be too bad. I will point out that it can use Technician boosted Hidden Powers though, a rare quirk that only certain Pokémon can really use well.

So i thought i'd start taking some old fakemon i made awhile back and putting them to use here

Name: Noshark

Sprite: Gible

Type: Water/Fight

Concept: A shark pokemon with a large nose and has grown fists where its fins are. It is heavily violent and beats its prey to a pulp.

Ability: Iron Fist

Stats:

HP: 95
ATK: 85
DEF: 100
SPA: 45
SPD: 90
SPE: 75

BST: 490

Moves:
Waterfall
Circle Throw
Rest
Bulk Up
Revenge
Ice Punch
Drain Punch
Counter
Detect
Earthquake
Dragon Tail
Stone Edge
Bullet Punch
Focus Punch
Thief
Surf
Dive
Work Up
Ice Beam
Mind Reader


It is based off the shark pokemon here: http://diesel165.deviantart.com/art/Sketches-339482672

that's my deviantart btw ~

Name: Eonaqus

Type: Flying/Water

Ability: Storm Drain

BST:

Moves:

Concept:

These Pokémon were once considered a race of sea gods to humans. They appeared only during storms and helped sailors cross dangerous seas by stopping the storms and gaining power from them. They are loving and gentle creatures, their feathers are said to be able to make people happy when they touch them. They have 4 white and blue wings, a small dragon like head with no nostrills and a small but thick body. They stand on 2 legs, which have various small holes in them, from where they breathe. Their brain is not inside the head, but instead, inside the torso, covered by various layers of muscle along with their heart. That's because their brain is very developed, being able to read minds and move objects through telepathy. They are colored in a very weak blue, which can change tone depending on the ocean itself.



Okay, opinions?Also, ortographic corrections would be nice, because i'm pretty sure I've made a mistake or more somewhere and I might've skipped them

@Diogo: You forgot to mention which sprite you would like to use for Eonaqus, and you have one extra BST point that you can use if you want (since you have base 102 speed, you take away four BST points, then you have a max of 536 BST points.).

You also mentioned that Eonaqus has a dragon-like head. Does this mean that it is like a dragon in some ways? If it is, then I would add at least one Dragon move somewhere over one move that Eonaqus doesn't really need (like Leer).

With Dragon like head, I mean a head like Charizard's, a reptilian head of some sort.

The sprite, meh, I'm still thinking about it xD

And how much BST is left?4 points?

5 bst left. i think 540 is the limit and should i add any moves to Noshark? Invalid said Sleep Talk is now a required move like return and whatnot and i think he works as a bulk up sweeper well... but i feel like he's missing something, maybe higher stats? idk

diogofrp wrote:

With Dragon like head, I mean a head like Charizard's, a reptilian head of some sort.

The sprite, meh, I'm still thinking about it xD

And how much BST is left?4 points?

Ok, that makes sense for the head. I would then give it something like Crunch, just so it has another physical move, and because it makes sense.

Yeah, the sprite would be tricky. I might recommend Mantyke or Magikarp here.

Also, the correct answer is that you have 1 BST point extra. Yes, the limit for BST is 540. However, your base speed is 102, which goes over the max speed limit of 100. You take away 2 BST points for every BST point over the limit, so in this case, you would have a max BST of 536.

My very ugly drawing of my cap

My latest CAP:

Name: Kamilra

Preferred Sprite: Numel (for now, I might change it)

Concept:

Type: Ground / Water

Base Stats:

Ability: Water Absorb

Moves:

What do you guys think; should I change anything about it?

STEEL OMFG WE CAN'T HAVE A CAP NAMED CAMEL TOE ARE YOU HIGH?

Also Karakia won't be implemented as is, it's better Arbok/Seviper, that should have been an easy thing to notice since Ekans was the chosen sprite. Maybe I haven't been clear in the past, but I don't want BetterMons in CAP. I'm all for things occupying similar roles, but Karakia has the same or higher in every stat, and better typing, with the same ability, and also sharing Coil.

Ok, I changed the name Kamilto to Kamilra, and I replace the move Slack Off for Stealth Rock. Any other thoughts on Kamilra?

What's wrong with camel toe?O_o

Is there something I should know?

Wow, you can find anything on the internet nowadays.

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Also Karakia won't be implemented as is, it's better Arbok/Seviper, that should have been an easy thing to notice since Ekans was the chosen sprite. Maybe I haven't been clear in the past, but I don't want BetterMons in CAP. I'm all for things occupying similar roles, but Karakia has the same or higher in every stat, and better typing, with the same ability, and also sharing Coil.

When I made Karakia, I wanted to make a Pokémon that was capable of using Coil and being a solid threat to other Pokémon, which I feel that Karakia achieves. When making a Coil user, you obviously have to have a long, snake-like Pokémon, as it doesn't make sense otherwise to have Coil.

It makes sense for me to change certain attributes of a CAP if those attributes directly outclass other commonly-used Pokémon, as was the case with CAMEL-TOE recently. However, when Arbok / Seviper are both not really used at all, I don't see why Karakia has to worry about outclassing them in particular. I would be open to changing Karakia if it was better than many of the standard Dragons (like Haxorus, Hydreigon, Dragonite, Salamence, and Latios), but I relly think that those other Dragons mostly outclass Karakia (due to better stats and access to Outrage). Also, its hard sometimes not to indirectly outclass one of the 649 Pokémon currently in existence; I think that we should be allowed to outclass to a degree some Pokémon that are not used much at all.

If I'm wrong, or if you disagree, let me know. For now though, I don't see why I need to change anything about Karakia.

Steel, i think you're right in some sense because Arbok and Seviper are both lower tier threats that would have no chance in Standard and therefore making another snake like pokemon that outclasses them and is useable in Standard would be fair, its like saying you can't use Salamence because it outclasses Altaria... sure they both do the same thing but Salamence is just better for Standard. But Kamilra imo shouldn't be allowed because Gastrodon and Quagsire are already fairly good in Standard and making something with the same typing and better stats just to outclass them just seems kind of ridiculous since they're already useable in Standard. So imo Karakia, yes it makes sense, Kamilra, no...

I was also afraid Noshark would be denied because it's almost a better Poliwrath imo but then again Poliwrath can run Water Absorb or Swift Swim which can be a better ability for it than Noshark's Iron Fist, which is a better ability for it... and also Poliwrath wouldn't fair much in Standard anyway so it would be fine to me to have a pokemon like it that's useabe in Standard.

Also i don't think every CAP should get Rest and Sleep Talk as its sort of giving them a way to recover easily using 2 moves which is a hinder and a benefit imo. Plus not all Pokemon with Rest get Sleep Talk and not all Pokemon with Sleep Talk get Rest... And i'm fine with Skoison's movepool, it seems big enough to me already so the add on of 2 extra moves doesn't seem necessary.

@Supergassy: Kamilra may have good stats; I can agree with that. However, Kamilra doesn't have Recover whereas Gastrodon and Quagsire do. That alone is a major difference; many bulky Water Pokémon get a move like Recover, yet Kamilra only gets Rest. Also, the only Ice-typed move that Kamilra gets is Hidden Power Ice, whereas Quagsire and Gastrodon both get better Ice moves than that. Kamilra lives n the desert, so it didn't make sense to give it ice-typed moves

When I made Kamilra I was thinking "I don't think that there has been a camel Pokémon made yet; what would a camel Pokémon be like?"

Also, I commented on the dispersion of Rest / Sleep Talk because the last few CAPs (around the last five or so) didn't have Rest or Sleep Talk in their movepools, and both Rest and Sleep Talk are 'default moves' that most CAPs get. It just seemed odd that those moves were left out on the last few CAPs.

Actually uhh Numel and Camerupt are Camels... j.s

Name: Drilwurm

Sprite: Weedle

Concept: A large worm like Pokemon who's front and bottom are made of drills made out of hard rocks. It's large body is full of rings of spikes which rotate to help it be one of the fastest digging pokemon around. It can travel underground at nearly 70 mph. It is rarely seen out of the ground due to this and uses this vast speed to attack its prey from the ground.

Type: Bug/Ground

Ability: Mold Breaker

Stats:

Spoiler:

Moves:

Spoiler:

One of my first attempts at making a strong pokemon for a CAP Creative tier, though maybe not. It can seem useful to me as a spikes/sr lead with taunt and u-turn and an effective baton passer or choice bander with u-turn. And being faster than latias and unscarfed rotoms with Earthquake and Mold Breaker it can hit them with STAB EQ's maybe it's too much? Idk let me know. I'm still questioning it.

Actually almost every single Pokemon learns both rest and sleep talk. That's why it's on the default list, that's what the list is all about.

http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Rest#By_TM
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Sleep_talk#By_TM

I'm just going to point out something: Out of all of our CAPs, we only have one Dark typed CAP, one Psychic typed CAP, and one Ice typed CAP currently implemented. If any of you have any CAP ideas with these types, you might want to think about implementing them soon.

well i had my dark/psychic type CAP but Invalid said it'd be best just not to post it.